question/structures/scanning/embedding media

gtoledo3's picture

To paraphrase Seinfeld, "what's the deal with loading from folders/ directory scanning"?

Is it more efficient, performance wise, to have a qtz where all of the media is totally integrated into one massive qtz file, or is it more efficient to have parts in separate qtz's and load via scanning? One thing I notice, is that with 3D stuff, it seems like having it integrated into the file is the way to go... when a macro has been "loaded" or called upon, I see the hit from loading the object happen only once, when the macro is in the file. When it's directory scanned, I see the hit every single time. Does this carry over to typical files, like "image filter units" as well? I think that some image filters are so trivial that it is impossible to tell. In other scenarios, it seems as though the hit is massive.

I seem to notice the same thing with simple things like photos. If I load a crapload of big photos inside of a qtz, it takes quite awhile to fire up. So, that's not a great scenario. When you load via a scanner, it seems generally more efficient- until you hit a "big" file. At that point you see the little stutter... and you see it every time. That makes me think that putting everything "in" a qtz is generally better, but I haven't had time to really test this.

Thoughts?

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cybero's picture
Re: question/structures/scanning/embedding media

Horses for Courses, squire.

Large Picture files - I don't usually embed nowadays.

Large Movie files - from external

Slideshows, all bespoked to be the same general configuartion size dpi , etc, loads best externally.

Give the slideshow any rare exceptions and it will falter somewhat.

3D - embed IMHO - might change if support further improves of course.

Putting everything inside the .qtz is not IMHO the best option, not always.

I would freely admit to having a bias towards externally loaded resources and internally generated resources by and large.

I think that efficiency wise more often than not a set of broadly congruent resources will slideshow more easily than a set of broadly disparate graphical resources.

I take something of a similar view on this to doing slideshows for the web. Keep it all congruent dimensions and file specifications wise, highest fidelity, lowest possible file size and the most efficient loading possible.

YMMV :-)

gtoledo3's picture
Re: question/structures/scanning/embedding media

Hmm, I don't buy the slideshow comment. I've done many setups where I use a multiplexer and embedded images. It always works better than pulling from a location. However, I've setup many macros that pull from directory and load ... I always seem to regret that course later on, if image/file sizes aren't all consistent.

I have a bias towards everything being "hardwired". That way, you have your initial load time, and you're done. There's no constant searching. With loading via scanning, it seems like it's the same as going into Finder and typing a file type of whatever, and waiting for your list to be built, then retrieved. It also seems like the scanner engine is constantly churning away, even after the initial structure is built. There is none of that going on if your the file is in the qtz, or if there is "simple" file loading, ala having a loader with a specific file path...

Note, I mean this as an entirely distinct scenario from simply pulling a file path that has no structure/scanning going on. I note no hit from that, except when the renderer fires off.

Sometimes, I feel like the render in image can be used to my advantage for that. It seems like once whatever is in the render has fired once, there is never any lag thereafter.( I'm getting away from the original topic, but you can also use it for down sampling- which can tremendously improve performance, and it seems like it makes things that are offscreen not evaluate if you put in a specific pixel width/height. I've done that and noticed some big gains in certain scenarios.... I want QC to be "smarter" about these issues!)

cybero's picture
Re: question/structures/scanning/embedding media

Quote:

Hmm, I don't buy the slideshow comment. I've done many setups where I use a multiplexer and embedded images. It always works better than pulling from a location.

As it happens, I've got some slideshow work coming up on my schedule so I'll take the opportunity to try and test different working methods. May as well hold my personal biases to test, just for the sake of efficiency :-)

I almost always pull from a location at root or first level directory, are you spanning the known /User/ area instead when loading externally ? I recall an example you posted which sensibly IMHO utilised a ./Media directory for the purpose of demonstrating Audio Tools wonderful ability to bring audio into Quartz Composer .

Would you find that the multiplexer model works best for say 30 average size 1MB images, for example.

I'm just beginning to make fairly regular use of the Performance Inspector, and can see some of the Render in Image related [or perhaps not entirely related] performance results

< off topic entirely - possibly another topic - I'm a little vague about if QC users are still trying to figure out how to render their compositions with audio interaction within Quartz Crystal , drawing audio in via the Audio Tools patch as an external resource to run local from one's directory is my preferred option to obtain at a 1.00 Timeline , with a timecode conditional taken from the Audio File Info duration info output, a method that more faithfully represents the audio interactive graphics >

usefuldesign.au's picture
Re: question/structures/scanning/embedding media

Quote:
I'm a little vague about if QC users are still trying to figure out how to render their compositions with audio interaction within Quartz Crystal

I had so many problems with this (during tb's RandomWalk comp moment) I gave up for greener pastures (on the other side!). If anybody has knowledge of, or would like to provide a simple tutorial on the "best" way to do it, this novice would be grateful for one.

franz's picture
Crystal Audio

i'm personally using KnM Audio File Input. Never had any problems so far. (maybe i'm just lucky). If you want interaction from a "live" external source (like the microphone), i would suggest making first a recording, then using this technique, it should work.

cybero's picture
Re: Crystal Audio

I am also using Kineme File Input - see attached example using the ./Media loading. You will have to create a Media directory at the root level of the directory and place an audio file of your own in place to make this work.

Being duration conditioned, the rendering will stop once your choice of audio has stopped playing.

You'll need to double check that all paths to your files are correct wheresoever patches require such information.

PreviewAttachmentSize
QCwithAudio.qtz113.82 KB

usefuldesign.au's picture
Re: Crystal Audio

Thanks Fz and cybero

Will give it another go and persevere this time. Might have been something else in the comp bugging it. I seem to remember it stalls without flicking the inputs around to start with which obviously can't be done in QCrystal.

cybero's picture
Re: Crystal Audio

check out the arrangement in the Render in Image